Living in Peru : your everyday companion

Living in Peru
Larry J. Pitman

“He who fears something gives it power over him.”
- Moorish Proverb

Our friend from Santiago, Chile, was astonished. He saw me sliding into place the iron gates that cover our French doors at night, giving the light and airy rooms a prison-like aspect. He noted the alarm system with the electrical wires that went around the house. He saw the broken glass sticking up from the top of the high walls around the house. He heard the barking of our two dogs.

Add to del.icio.us |

The simple facts are that Peru is a nation with individuals whom choose to kill and steal instead of work.  This is compounded by the lack of law enforcement there.  In the poor nation of Peru the need for security is paramount.  The people there know only that they will be robbed and possibly murdered by criminals in addition to the fact that the police there will do nothing to combt the crime. If there were an actual enforcement of laws there and a police presence then the high security culture would one day change.  Until then the people's fears are indeed justified.

Honestly, I feel safe in Lima. I think is depend where you live or where you are walking around. All the big cities have dangerous places and safe places. I have been in the poor nation of Chile and there is a security problem there too. I was surprise about the beginning of the story, becasue I have seen the same security that Lima houses has down there in Chile. 
About the comment of SA that "Perú is a nation with individual whom choose to kill and steal instead of work", I can say that in all the nations you find this kind of peolple, is stupid to say that only in Perú you find these people. You can find them in USA, Germany, Japan, everywhere. For instance, Pinochet-dictator of Chile- was a criminal who steal and kill and he never went to jail, and what is worse he is a heroe for some chileans.
FY

I think, if the opportunity is 'created' to thiefs for a easy hit,the'll take it !
Here in the US, thiefs are bold and plan risks. For the most part they assault banks,pharmacies and careless individuals to pay for their drug additions. It seems,their drug habit is so strong,they'll do the crime without considering the consequences (armed robberies/murder).
About 2-3 months LIP had a feature on thieves ("A Lima classic")...I feel 'we' discussed many alternatives for this 'tipical' problem in Lima and for the most part all big cities.(Poverty vs. crime).
I'm not sure, but my feeling on Lima's robberies/assaults,is more of a 'challenge' for the perpetrator than a need for survival. And,if that's the case, yes we need to be in fear ! (a social problem?-doesn't matter...)
Nothing wrong about protecting our love ones and our property. 

I am a peruvian woman living in Australia for more than four years now.  When I met my husband who is australian in Peru, he was also surprised to find out that most peruvians live "behind bars".  When I arrived to Australia, one of the first things he said was, you have nothing to worry here, you can live without fear, this is a wealthy country.  I must said being peruvian it took me while to get used to the fact that I dont have to look after my purse all the time and that i can walk freely wearing jewelry and all of that.  After some time I finally got used to living free without fear, I was a new person, I must admit I quite liked it.  Unfortunately, months later someone stole my purse from a coffee place while having coffee with a friend in the city (Melbourne).  When I realised about the incident, I couldnt help to feel fear and feel unsafe again.  I kept thinking, this would have never happened to the old me. Because the old me would have been more careful to look after my bag.  Months later, someone broke into the neighbour's car, they were after the music player.  I must say this not everyday news, but this sort of things do happen and are getting more frequent.  It is also getting very popular people installing security cameras in their front door, in fact we are thinking in doing the same.
I agree is not good to live with fear, but is good to be cautious, alert and at least prevent this kind of things from happening.  That's what I learnt while living in Lima.
I had the opportunity to travel to many many places and learnt there is no safe place anywhere in the world.

Dear SA,

It is said that crime is common in Peru according to your personal and biased opinion.  Why do you live here, then??

Let us tell you dear SA that in our English class, we do not believe that Peruvian individuals choose to kill and steal instead of work.  Unfortunately, comments like yours damage our image especially this Apec week.

We cannot deny that crime is running in the streets of any multicultural and overcrowded city, but in Lima it is mainly due to unemployment and poverty.  We do not want to justify crime, but we dislike the idea that you consider poor people criminals and murderers.

Where are you from? 

We recommend you to get more information regarding this and cultural matters.

Best regards-

Two months ago, I had a terrible experience; two guys stole me and indeed I was in shock for several days. I am Peruvian, and it is a pity that this kind of facts happen in our city, but if you really think about this matter, all over the world the same is happening.  Maybe it is because most young people use drugs and they need to steal for buying the drug.  Definetely, I´m sure that this is not only in Lima, it´s happening at the same time in other countries. Moreover, nobody can  affirm that all Peruvian people only want to steal or do you happen to know everybody who lives in Lima says that about Peru?
At present, I continue with my life, I work, study and do everthing.  In addition, I am also attentive and alert when I am in the street.
Last but not least, if you watch the news you can see that this is taking place not only in Peru but in other developing and developed countries. 

Hey,what does 'multicultural' has to do with crime in Peru? I don't see chinese, germans or italians doing the crimes...? For the most part are the very same peruvians, young and old, monopolizing the robberies and street assaults.

Ok, so we could be talking about the lack of education,resources, the unemployment, minimal police protection...etc.

If a mother of 5 can beg for money in the streets for 10-12 hours,why can't their teen age sons or daughters do something to earn a few soles?...instead of stealing for drugs?  Sorry, but that's what i find multicultural = DRUGS ! 

Yes, crime is everywhere these days, and as there are so many reasons for it, it would be pointless trying to cover those issues here.   Anyway, the good news for Peruvians is that statistically, murder seems to be still a relatively rare crime there.  According to nationmaster.com,  Peru ' only ' has 1,100 murders a year.  Here in South Africa we succeed in killing off nearly 23,000 people a year - bear in mind that the South African population is double that of Peru and most of the people are impoverished.   
So even though you may think that crime is out of control in Peru, believe me, there are other places which are worse.  Amongst our friends and acquintances  10 people have been murdered in all over the last ten years or so - usually in the course of house robberies or car-jacking.  Seems to be a case of the have nots needing what the    ' haves ' have and as long as there is widespread poverty this problem will be here to stay.

I've heard they just openned a McDonalds in the middle of the Imperial City of Cuzco !!

Did someone forget to rise a 'muralla' and electrical fences around the historical Inca City ??

Wasn't enough,the spaniors building their churches over Inca's monumental city....and now we have the 'Golden Arches' doing the same ?? It is a shame !

 Sad, Cusco wasn't "Behind bars"...... 

I'd have to say that after over 3 years of Living in Peru, I fully agree with SA's comments.  Especially those about the lack of enforcement.  I personally have either been the victim or was there at the time of a number of crimes here in Peru. 

Police presence is non-existant.  Police response is like playing the lottery (you almost never win, but it does happen).  Most Peruvians tell you to not even report crimes to the police.  Almost all residential neighborhoods must have and pay security guards because the police constantly fail to do their jobs.

At any moment in Peru you can be attacked and even murdered and there is little hope of the police ever catching the guilty parties.  The worst part is that this also applies to your family members.  So not only do you need to live in fear for yourself, but also for everyone that you know or are responsible for.

Even with all of the bars, gates, spikes, glass, etc. major crime continues to be a major problem in Peru.  Recently a friend of the family had their house entered and all items of value were removed.  My own house has been targeted and robbed many times over the last few years and it has gotten worse lately (luckily nothing of major value has been lost yet).  My landlord's nephew just got his credit card cloned at an ATM last week and they took all of his money out of his account before he noticed.

I couldn't believe the sight I saw the other day while driving through downtown Lima.  There were a number of 'security' and police trucks patrolling the area.  They all had metal cages built over the windows!!!  I could not believe it!  Apparently the security guards and police are so scared of the criminals that they lock themselves in metal cages inside their vehicles!  What are normal people supposed to think when they see this?!?!

If the police and security need to hide behind metal bars when on the streets, it would be better if normal people did not ever go to these same streets!  I understand that sometimes you need vehicles like this for riot control or major events, but this was just a normal weekday night in downtown Lima.  There were no events, riots, or anything else going on.

I agree with the other comments that there is always somewhere worse and that crime happens everywhere.  But this site is about Peru and in Peru it is a massive, widespread, and invasive problem.

Good comment Splaktar...are most crimes commited in Lima with fire arms??  How are these arms available to the criminals and thieves?

As a citizen, can you carry a concealed weapon within the law? In other words, can anyone carry a gun? (permited or not?). Are there any peruvian laws that allow a citizen to defend himself, including fire arms?

And if there isn't a law for protection, why not?...if the police is not available everywhere, what is the option for self-protection?

Guns don't kill people, people do!...so, is gonna be them (the thieves/criminals) or you !

Some criminals, specially those organized ones that clean out entire houses, use guns.  Most common criminals do not use guns.

It is very hard to get a gun to protect yourself or your house in Peru.  First of all the price is extremely high (I believe all must be imported).  Secondly the licensing and such is expensive and difficult to get approved.

I've asked around a number of times for concealed weapons laws, but most people just say 'why would you need a license if it's concealed? who would see it?' ...

Many villiages far from cities who do not have police protection or have insufficient protection, take the law into their own hands.  Some of these militias have guns (out there, no one is equipped to hand out licenses or anything like that).  Though I have really never heard of the militias actually killing people with guns.  They generally prefer to capture the theives and then take them to either a field or the center of town.  Then they put them into a car or tie them up and burn them alive!  This has seriously happened more than once in the last year.

From everything that I've seen and heard, it is easier for criminals to get weapons than for law abiding citizens.  I've also heard more stories about guns in prisons (inmates with gun) than I've heard in the public.

Many of the men in Peru are ex-military or police due to the requirement to enroll for most young men.  So they often continue to carry guns after they serve.

I witnessed a shooting in La Victoria earlier this year.  But it appeared to be a warning shot just to scare away theives.  After the shot I saw about 8 young men run away scared for their lives.  And most of the people in the street seemed calm and did not have any complaint with the guy who fired his gun.

I still called the police about the incedent immediately, but they never did come to investigate.  I watched for them about 3 hours.

You are right! We should be aware of criminals in Lima; I think culture affects people behaviors so they can't handle their fears. Peru has passed a terrible period of terrorism, but those days are gone. Nowadays, the consequences are showed in people's fear. I think that this is the main reason why people have a strong security in their houses.
José Quintanilla A.  23:38 24/11/08
(7-9am) Dedicaded to Carmen R.

Ok,so i sense,the "wachiman" does play a part on crime avoidance.
Would thieves prefer to hit homes in La Victoria or San Isidro/Miraflores/
Barranco/La Molina,etc.(The more afluential neighborhoods?)...
Splaktar mentions of his house being targeted but nothing of value has YET been lost....what items are the thieves after ?
The warning shots heard at night in La Victoria worked well to spook the young thieves....can more available guns to law abiding citizens serve the same purpose?
If walls,spikes,electrical wires,glass on top of the walls don't really work...the sound of a barking dog,alarm and ultimally a shot in the air from a gun would work,wouldn't it?

Actually the gun shots that I witnessed were around mid-day.

Thieves seem to move around to different districts.  Some just take advantage of oppotunity, a door left ajar, they see people leaving the house with suitcases, a lady who always leaves and goes home alone, etc.

Others work in organized groups and hit certain areas repeatedly until police presence is finally increased.  Then they move on to another area where no police can be seen all day long.

The items so far stolen from my building have been TVs (thieves entered the garage with a key that was apparently sold/given to them by a maid and then went into the downstairs apartartment while the habitants slept.  They stole a TV and some other random items in the living room), wheels (they came at night into the garage again via the door and stole 2 wheels from one of the cars in the garage.  It was 2-3 people at around 3-4am), bicycles (again they managed to get into the door of the garage which is the main building entrance.  they stole 2 bicycles and left the door open when they left around midnight).

Ideal items for thieves are any car parts (hundreds of shops buy used/stolen parts with no care at all where they came from), electronics (just the same people in mercados and other shops buy and resell stolen electronics of all kinds), etc.  Most of the stuff is not things that the theives need to survive, it is just stuff that they can sell.

Dogs do work pretty well in keeping out intruders or at least deterring them.  People also use cactus and other thorny plants to try to keep them out. 

As for dogs, they are great and can even save your life.  But I've personally have family who this year were gassed in their house and I believe that their dogs were poisoned at the same time.  The organized group of theives came in the night.  The gas worked very well and even though the family woke up, they were not able to walk or do anything to stop the thieves until they were gone.  The thieves hooked up a chain to their car and then used it to rip open the metal bars and door that protected part of their house.  Then they loaded up their car with everything that they could take.

So even while dogs are helpful, if you have an organized group of criminals and they know that there are computers (mostly what they stole) or other valuables in your house, they can still find ways to get in.  In this case, the police didn't show up until 3 days after the incident.  They didn't have any available 'vehicles' to take them to the place until that time.  And this was only after we made some calls to people we knew and had them pull strings and pressure people to actually send a unit to at least take a report.  This was in an area outside of Lima.

As with most security, stealth or concealment is the most effective means of protection.  In the cases of the home, this is easier to accomplish.  In the case of businesses which require computers for public use or other visible technology or valuables, this isn't an option.

Many people in Lima never open their curtains or allow visitors into their homes for this very reason.  They don't want anyone seeing what is inside.  Along this same theme, many people who travel or bring things into their houses only do so at odd hours (1-6am) to avoid being seen by neighbors or thieves.

...i'm still in the dark about WHO fired those shots in La Victoria...was it a private citizen or a policeman?
This is an amazing account of the way crime has developed in Lima. It sure opens my eyes...thanx Splaktar.
I still have my hopes that an alarm and a gun are, by new standards, the equipment of choice to deter robberies and break ins. (Dogs do get poisoned but they are "cheap" to replace).
When growing up in Lima, i used to own a hunting rifle. Are they still available?
Thieves are ahead of the game since there are not enough effective obsticles to overcome. I'm sure,the police would like to see more citizens fight crime with innovating means.
What an idea for a new business in Lima....

I hope this shuts both of you assholes up, why dont you just exchange phone numbers?

The Island | Patchogue
Immigrants Say Slaying Brings Bias to the Fore
Sign In to E-Mail or Save This
Print
Single Page
Reprints
Share

By ROBIN FINN
Published: November 21, 2008

Patchogue
Enlarge This Image
 
Maxine Hicks for The New York Times

STRENGTH IN NUMBERS More than 500 people attended a vigil for Marcelo Lucero, who was beaten and fatally stabbed Nov. 8 near the railroad station in Patchogue. Bottom, David Ajamarca and his daughter Cara, left, were there to plead for peace.
In the Region
Complete Coverage
Long Island | Westchester
Connecticut | New Jersey
Related
A Principal Struggles With a Killing’s Aftermath (November 23, 2008)

AT the murder site vigil for Marcelo Lucero, suddenly a national symbol for what law enforcement officials say can go tragically wrong when a gang of teenagers fueled by hate, booze and ignorance embarks on a vigilante rampage, intolerance was notable by its absence. So was racism. The word hate? Not in evidence, except on homemade signs, distributed by sweetly smiling, bilingual elementary schoolchildren, asking for an end to it.

After removing a Bluetooth from his ear, Mr. Lucero’s preternaturally dignified younger brother, Joselo, 34, confronted a scrum of television cameras and articulated a similar message, eloquently, in Spanish and English. “We come here for peace,” he said, lamenting the unforeseen loss of a brother who “was killed here for no reason.” A brother who left a grief-stricken family behind; immigrants, Mr. Lucero noted, are not inhuman aliens.

He called for posthumous justice for Marcelo, not out of vengefulness toward the attackers, “but to make an example so this never happens to anyone again.”

Joselo Lucero stood at a makeshift lectern next to a spot-lit shrine here on Nov. 14 — besides flowers, flags, balloons and a beatific mural of Marcelo, who was stabbed to death on Nov. 8, it held a teddy bear cradling a soccer ball — and spoke softly but forcefully about the inexcusably cruel fate his brother met merely for his ethnicity. The big brother he followed from poverty in Ecuador to an apartment in the poorest patch of Patchogue in search of a more lucrative life. The brother who, inside a metal casket — a local donation — returned to Ecuador last week just as a grand jury was scheduled to unveil its indictments against seven teenagers accused of taking part in his killing. All seven pleaded not guilty at an arraignment after their arrests.

In front of the shrine was the outline of a heart painstakingly composed of purple and white votive candles. Mr. Lucero was 37 when he died and had, his friends say, been thinking of selling his Honda Accord — a modest status symbol in a community where rusty bicycles are the ubiquitous transit workhorse — and returning to Ecuador. He was homesick. Mr. Lucero, who moved here 16 years ago, missed his mother and wanted to see the house his wages had built for her.

But on Nov. 8, the seven teenagers, all from Patchogue-Medford High School but none from Patchogue Village, a longtime ethnic melting pot and of late a locus for Ecuadorean and Salvadoran immigrants, apparently made it their mission to “jump a Mexican,” according to the police. Mr. Lucero, a convenient victim, fit the bill closely enough. He tried to defend himself, the police said, but one hatemonger had a knife and chose to use it.

According to village officials, this is the first known instance of a bias murder in their village; according to Hispanic residents, it is not the first instance of biased behavior.

“These kids are coming here and harassing us more often,” said one careworn, bike-riding mourner from a neighborhood that seems less of a haven than it used to. Old enough to qualify for AARP membership, he disclosed that he is Salvadoran but refused to give his name “because the kids see me around and know who I am.”

“At night they throw rocks and bottles,” he said. “They heckle us and try to engage us; they want a fight.” Sometimes the kids do worse things. “They slashed my tires outside the library one afternoon. A lot of them carry knives. The ones who did this to Marcelo had no compassion, no morals, no nothing.”

Christopher Capobianco, a 17-year resident, called Mr. Lucero’s death “a punch in the stomach.”

“I’m a 50-year-old white guy,” he said, “and I’m angry that these little punks came into our village and attacked one of our brothers.”

At the Friday-night vigil, Joselo Lucero, his eyes puffy from tears, wore a button with a poignant message: I Am Marcelo. He had plenty of company.

More than 500 people huddled in a chilly, slanting rain on the north side of the railroad tracks where Mr. Lucero, who worked at a dry cleaner in Riverhead, was battered, stabbed in the chest and left to die.
1 2 Next Page »

E-mail: theisland@nytimes.com

jcw

The shot was fired by a private citizen (ex-police is just my guess).  He had the gun in his car.

Yes, Hunting Rifles are still available in some shops in Lima.

There are actually a good deal of fairly new security, bodyguard, etc type shops in both Lima and Arequipa.  When I've gone looking for a few security related items for the house, they have always been sold out.

Why so hasty CJ ? I think we are all talking about protecting our homes and belongins and not at all about "racism" or "hate crimes".

In case you haven't noticed, the article is about fear and living "behind bars".

At this point CJ, all i have to say  is :"Don't be a HUE-WONG", i'd like to see how will you protect yourself when the time comes ? ( a nail clipper and a broom ?)...

brilliant comment!

fear goes away with a gun in your pocket? all the guns
in the world havent reduced much the perception of fear in

urban areas in the large cities (usa) i've lived in.

If you want to live in a cage with shotguns, etc. move to baghdad,
try visiting other peruvian cities like arequipa or cusco to get a better perspective. lima's problems have to do with inadequate police resources not some peruvian predisposition for crime. try caracas o ciudad de mexico for some real crime.

el huevon eres tu si crees que la seguridad de tu familia depende de la pistola que llevas en el bolsillo, Quesseso.

jcw

 Ok JC..."nail clippers and broom" it is.

 "You must be the change you want to see in the world !"....
...in Mexico City,Caracas,Los Angeles,Cusco or Arequipa. Let me know of the progress.
And as far as Baghdad, from what i've heard, it's the law of the gun,for peace or otherwise...I think is called war. Fear of peace by the Taliban and BIG business for the U.S. gov. 

EAP I Usil university students

Your response was indeed extremely biased.

You will hopefully learn that resolving the issues of crime and theft will do more than simply whining about them. 

You will also hopefully learn that others may have opinions that may or may not be the same as yours. 

Why do you want to know where I live??? 

Do you want to rob and murder me???

I reccomend that you get your facts first regarding this and cultural matters before whining like a bunch of children.

Happy holidays.

you hold on to that shotgun now, make sure they dont steal it from you.

keep it handy next to your tarantino, chuck norris and clint eastwood dvd collection, some shells too.

jcw

"You must be the change you want to see in the world !"....
carve it on your gun and read it to the thief before you shoot him, pulp fiction style.
look up this video Iraqi_Weddingg.wmv too see what I mean.

 JC, you must be watching too much t.v. or spend too much money on dvd rentals....
Once again, we are talking primeraly about "protecting and avoiding" theft in our homes...(ei: alarms,dogs and yes shots in the air) Not about "killing people" ! How else do you figure out we will deter threats and menaces from trespasers ? We know, calling the police is not working but to the criminal's favor. High walls, elect. wires and broken glass on the walls may tell a message to intruders, but action will tell the story loud and clear...and in your face !
Tell me, what is your idea on avoiding thieves in your house ? Is your family prepared to act accordingly ?
I hope your ego is not hurt...Wong.

W
I see, you'll keep your guns in the closet, take them out when the thief knocks on your door, get the shells, load up the gun, shoot your ceiling or run outside and shoot the neighbor's wall, and in the meanwhile hope that the thieves get scared at your gringo ways and run off scared like little girls. The only message I'm getting is that you're a fckn idi*t.

It's not my ego you're hurting, it's my intelligence.

.. Is your family prepared to act accordingly ?....
What do you think they should do? ...right, i'll get my kid a bb gun and
my 8 month baby what, a plastic gun? teach her to scream ladron!ladron! policiiia!! hahhaahah

LOL, you tough guy you. the thieves reading this forum must be laughing their asses off.

We had a shotgun at home (near plaza S.M.) when I was growing, it never helped much. The house got broken in twice, they took the toaster and some other sh*t from the kitchen. never got to shoot anybody. Our asshole neighbor chased some thieves down the street once, started shooting a rifle in the middle of a residential street!!

youre so fgkng stupid I dont know what else to say.

jcw

JC, looks like i got you all worked up about this subject...

Anyway, it's just useless...Your way, my way, It doesn't matter.

Don't get pissed off... use that anger and energy when your car or home gets broken in.

Good luck.

Don't bother responding to jcw.  He's just a troll that spreads hate and non-sense on these forums.  If they could, he would have been banned a long time ago.

a LOT of places in Santiago de Chile are exactly the same like this.
maybe not in the same quantity as Lima, but your chilean friend comment is a "little bit" biased.

you take it easy too  wasatch, thanks for the advice.
merry xmas to you and SPLAKTAR!!!
same to you lip editor, thanks for not banning me

jcw
"the hateful troll"