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Peru Police Chief States he did not Sell Meteorite Fragments to U.S. Collector

(LIP-ir) -- The Chief of Police in the area where the meteorite landed on September 15, denied having sold fragments of the meteorite to Michael Farmer, a meteorite collector.

Peru's El Comercio newspaper reported today that Victor Anaya, the Chief of Police in Desaguadero, Puno, Peru stated he did not sell fragments of the meteorite to the U.S. meteorite collector. Anaya stated that the accusations made by Farmer were "completely false."

Anaya explained that Farmer had made these accusations because Peru's police had not permitted him into the crater left by the meteorite. According to Anaya, the meteorite collector only had a tourist pass and was therefore not authorized to take samples.

Anaya stated that only Peru's scientists were permitted near the crater and allowed to take samples of the meteorite which landed in the region last month.

On the contrary, Erick Vidal, a specialist for Peru's Geophysics Institute stated that Peru's police had denied him access to the meteorite and did not allow him to do any research. In addition, Gavino Ramos Madani, a resident of the area, stated that Peru's police had gathered the majority of the meteorite fragments.

In light of the accusations, Anaya has requested that Puno's Regional Police open an investigation to clarify the accusations being made.

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# Michael Farmer says :
5 October, 2007 [ 23:09 ]

Oh, so I was not allowed into the crater by the police? How about this photo of me and the police IN THE CRATER?
I bet he will have a tough time explaining this.
Michael Farmer
http://meteoriteguy.com/carancascratercops.jpg

# Peruvian C.S says :
6 October, 2007 [ 00:21 ]

Doe s show that you were (present) at the location of the Meteiorite Site,again there is still the question of  the justification of mediations that took place between yourself Michael and the Police. There is still descrepancies issues in all areas of what has been said by all and these descrepancies of what was said hold the key, to this hold Fiasco.
I am not taking sides to what has been said...?

# Michael Farmer says :
6 October, 2007 [ 00:24 ]

What do you mean, I do not understand. what discrepencies?
Mike

See my website and learn more.
http://www.meteoriteguy.com/carancasfall.htm

# Peruvian C.S says :
6 October, 2007 [ 00:55 ]

The Discrepencies are simple: Is everything( and i mean everything) to what you have  said to be what was arranged to be exactly  TRUE within the course of Mediation taken place between you and the Police.

# doug Ward says :
6 October, 2007 [ 06:17 ]

Everyone knows underpaid cops are ALL lying ladrones.

I believe ya Mike. 

C.S. You spent too long in the empire. Get a reality check... we're talking PERU

# Michael says :
6 October, 2007 [ 06:41 ]

Not that I am surprised, but that Anaya is one lying SOB.

Don't worry, though; when someone in Peru's media gets the backbone to point out there are pictures and recordings, he'll change his story and claim previous stories were lies by the press.

# Peruvian C.S says :
6 October, 2007 [ 07:49 ]

Michael:
So far all everyone has had is your version of the events that you presume took place,no one has had the opportunity to hear the versions of the other party as of yet(apart from the Media speculation)so until you present this,( verbal clarifications/recordings)then we will be able to get a more clearer insite in to what really took place. If you want people to take sides,just on the asumptions of your words only,i see that as not being very fair.

As for you Doug Ward; One thing i have to say to you and that is not every Peruvian Cop or peruvian is Corupt, just because Peru has had a History of being un Stable and not to your expections that you judge this insident on the Culture of Peru as being all but Corupt,maybe you need to have a good look at yourself and your country.(so i will return your comment back to you,so you can own it and wear it) seeing it come from you. So take it from me,cleanup your own mess in your own country,before jumping on the back of another.

By the way, i,m not Peruvian and again irrespect that i am not,i do and will always have Respect for this Culture of People.

I have looked over all of  your Web sites Michael, as it tells a lot about what you do and why it is and why you do what you do.

# Michael says :
6 October, 2007 [ 07:52 ]

Peruvian CS:

Have you actually been to Peru?

# Peruvian C.S says :
6 October, 2007 [ 08:02 ]

Yes i have and not long ago too,for the Nature of why i was there was to Help the people in need,in the Southern remote communities and i will be returning  again to continue with our attempts to support those still in need.

# Michael Farmer says :
6 October, 2007 [ 11:24 ]

My friends, I have lived in Colombia and Panama. I have been to Africa more than 50 times. Corruption is not new to me, but I happen to speak spanish fluently, so I can FIGHT BACK in places like Peru. When I am threatend with jail or paying lots of money, I know howto get even. I have been on the phone emailing and sending photos to the Peruvian press.
Screw these cops, it is time someone took them down for hustling every gringo tourist they can, this one got attention of the national government, they must be squirming right now.

# mucho says :
6 October, 2007 [ 12:41 ]

Sharing with you an excerpt from La Republica (in Spanish, below).  It raises some interesting points.  Is it legal to buy meteorites? Is there any legal framework established in the country or internationally?  Does the host country, community, have any rights?  It assumes it has.  Is the case analogous to that of ancient ceramics?  The article makes reference to the valuable collection you can find at Yale (which was taken ilegally, as many other hundreds of collections looted by foreigners with purchasing power).  Is the scientific community losing an opportunity because of the greed of the local community, police and a quick collector/tourist? Is the local community wasting an opportunity for tourism?  The truth is that this story, though not that important, sounds very familiar.  Because of the lack of a clear legal framework, or the lack of integrity of the people involved - local and foreign, countries like Peru see their patrimony vanish at the loss to many and the benefit of a few.   


¿Es legal la compra del coleccionista? Existe una frondosa jurisprudencia sobre propiedad de objetos caídos del cielo (incluso satélites espías, como afirma Pravda que ha ocurrido en este caso). La norma es que al que le cae encima tiene ciertos derechos. Pero como en el caso de los huacos incaicos de Yale, aquí hay que preguntarse si el objeto vale el esfuerzo de rescatarlo.

Mientras se discute si la compra/venta es legal o no, resulta evidente que la enajenación ha sido dañina. Los científicos peruanos pierden un objeto de estudio (el saqueo inicial de Sipán recién descubierto debió alertarlos). Los pobladores de Chucuito se quedan con un cráter anegado y vacío, y una historia más bien triste, que no va a atraer a ningún turista.

Hasta aquí lo del meteorito parece una historia banal. Pero si miramos un poco las turbiedades que se advierten cráter adentro, advertiremos que la pérdida del patrimonio nacional a manos de visitantes más vivos, ayudados por compatriotas felipillescos, es una historia antigua y frecuente. Por desgracia no siempre protagoniza un modesto meteorito.

# David says :
6 October, 2007 [ 15:41 ]

Ahhh, But Mike, can you prove that is really you in the photos???

Now CS why does Mike have to prove the other persons opinion? He is the one coming forward with photos and alike. Do the police have any reports where they arrested anyone for entering a restrickted area? I think not.

It sounds like the police just covering there respected arses.

David

# randall gregory says :
6 October, 2007 [ 15:50 ]

My name is Randall Gregory and I am an Independent Researcher. I researched the Meteorite Fall in Aplao that happened in 2004. I have contacts at IGP and UNSA with various professors and doctors.

I believe I was the first American researcher to visit the crater. I'm sure an American toursist beat me to the punch.

I also know Mr. Farmer and have had conversations with him.

I wanted to aquire specimens to study and distribute to various institutions. I went to the crater first and purchased specimens from the land owner and some neighbors that had been sifting through the soil. I managed to accumulate about 278 gms.

Not knowing Desaguadero, I went to the Municipality to inquire and get as much information as possible. I was hoping to get a much larger stone for analysis and study. The municipality was closed for lunch so I waited out side. I was getting a little bored so I started talking to a police officer. I believe his name was Enrique. The police building is connected to the municipal building. I asked if there were any meteorites available for sale.

My Spanish is quite crude so he told me to wait. He then went to get his superior. Major Victor Anaya Borrientos, I talked with the major and told him who I was, what I do, and told him about my contact with the Geophysical Institute of Peru. I also told him my wife was Peruvian.
I asked him if there were any meteorites left and if need be. To purchase one for study. He told me they were already taken to Peru and Boliva Universities for study. I thanked him and left.

If the police had any stone left and wouldn't sell to an American researcher with a Peruvian wife. Then why would they sell to a dealer.

I have a difficult time believing Mr. Farmer's version.

Randall Gregory

# Peruvian C.S says :
6 October, 2007 [ 15:57 ]

Yes Mucho: These people think they,can just walk into a country and do what ever they like.They are only out to get what ever they can for themselves.Money is what their all about,at the expence of what ever it take. They will take away,from what ever it is,make a name for themselves,,make a profit,for time and time again.
Mark my word.

# Peruvian C.S says :
6 October, 2007 [ 16:51 ]

Hi David: Answer to your question is, these photos only tell half the story,what went as in mediation between the two parties is other.

# Michael Farmer says :
6 October, 2007 [ 17:17 ]

I speak fluent spanish, I had no problems buying from the police.
And if you are a resercher, I am the pope!
By the way, anyone on here who wants to see Randall Gregory's emails where he SAYS HE BOUGHT 4 KILOS from the Major, email me, I will forward them to you. The truth will set you free, Randall, you are a moron, you send emails, they are a record of your words. They can and will be turned against you.
Michael Farmer

# Peruvian C.S says :
6 October, 2007 [ 17:24 ]

Michael: If you have been mistreated unfairly,deal with it properly. Maybe you need the Legal Professional  to deal with this. I have'nt really got the time to be wasted go on + on+on. I,ve more important things to do. So from here Good luck. Adios.

# Michael Farmer says :
6 October, 2007 [ 17:42 ]

Peruvian C.S. So why the F^%% are you posting here? I am confused, did I ask you to post? Was I looking for information? I posted my story, take it or shove it.
I need no help, the damage is done, now the police are being investigated. End of story.

# Randall Gregory says :
6 October, 2007 [ 18:05 ]

Oh yes, I told you that. Because I knew your character. I can prove without any shred of doubt that I only $300 for my trip to Puno.  I had a $500 budget and $200 went for planefare. Subtract dinners, bus tickets, and a hotel room for 4 nights, plus bottled water, a shoeshine, a small bag of coca leaves for altitude sickness, cab fare from the airport, etc etc.  That left me with little money to buy stones. I went to the crater and bought only what I could afford, because I wanted to buy my wife a poncho.. Well when I returned to Puno I had enough left over to buy her two and one for myself, then bus fare to the Juliaca airport, a candy bar, water, and a newspaper. And still enough for cab fare from the Lima airport to my apartment. Not bad for $300. BTW, $300 converts to 920 soles. Which is the equivalent to 1 and one half month's pay for an average policeman. The police are poor, but they are moral. Unlike you.

Randall

# Randall Gregory says :
6 October, 2007 [ 18:09 ]

I consider myself a researcher and so do people at the University of San Augutin (UNSA) in Arequipa and the Geophysical Institute of Peru (IGP). Maybe you should ask them. I doubt they would lie.

And you are definiatly not the pope!

Randall

# ihaveaperuvianfriend says :
6 October, 2007 [ 18:19 ]

Yo Mike what's up? I just got back from Peru yesterday. I was at the meteor site last Thursday and have I got a crazy story for you. I didn't come with your group, but with another one, you might have recognized me, I'm not sure. I went for a few days, I was the guy with the sunglasses and the collar shirt on most of the time.

Anyway, I was talking to one of the campesinos and I was trying to trade them some packs of that new "5gum" to them in exchange for the meteorites. You know what I'm talking about, they have those cool commercials on TV now but the gum really just tastes like Wrigley's Spearmint. I figured they couldn't tell the difference anyway.
http://www.5gum.com/

I guess they were smarter than I thought because all I could get from them was a little satchel filled with what I thought were just old chicken bones. But when I got home I opened the satchel and looked at the bones closer and man these things are definitely NOT chicken bones. There are a bunch of tiny little skulls other body parts. If I put the bones together I can form like a crude skeleton of some kind. On top of that, when I opened the satchel after I got back home there was this really rancid smell and almost immediately my throat started burning and even my friend who came to visit me later started complaining of a burning sensation in his throat when he walked inside. I might see a doctor later, but I don't know..I'm kind of in disbelief. Looks like you had more luck than I did.

By the way, how much money are you going to make off of those meteorite fragments you bought? Those campesinos are so poor that I'm sure the 1000 dollars you gave them was like 100 or 200 thousand to us right? I can only imagine, considering how excited they were over the packs of gum I gave them. I doubt they'd even know what to do with a few hundred thousand American dollars right!

# Michael Farmer says :
6 October, 2007 [ 18:29 ]

I gave them equivelant of months or even a year salery, I will make money. that is business. Um, I did not try to trade gum for meteorites. It sounds like they gave you a hex! You are in trouble if they gave you bones, they cursed you dude.
mike

# MJC says :
6 October, 2007 [ 18:53 ]

That is what I was thinking, cursed! Bags of Bones are not good! Good luck to you man, I think you are going to need it.

On another note, I just read that the Peruvian Officials in charge are going to let the meteorite sit in water for the next two months? Is this true?

If it was not for you, Mike Farmer, researchers would not have pristine pieces in their hands right now. Good job, for being the only one to date to get this meteorite into the proper hands!

MJC

# Fozpa says :
6 October, 2007 [ 20:39 ]

It appears to me that Randall is afraid he might have to return his meteorites to the Peruvian Government. Denying that he has the 4000+ grams that he originally claimed to have is a simple way to protect his "booty". This will also help him score a few points with the locals since it might aid in getting the crooked cops and major off the hook.

# MJC says :
6 October, 2007 [ 21:14 ]

That is exactly what he is doing.  If anyone really cares (like a investigative reporter) they can go to the

Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com and check the archives. There they will find a wealth of information on this Randall Gregory.  Including the fact that he pretended to be a "Dr" on the mailing list under the name of Dr. Richard Daniels. 

He stated that he bought a 4 kilo piece from the police. He stated that he is "drinking buddies" with the police there and much more...

Maybe it is time for countries like Peru and others, especially the ones that cultivate and thrive on tourism to be more concerned when their police are shaking down and extorting tourists left and right. If you don't believe me check out the Lonely Planet Guide about this part of Peru, especially concerning the police! 

MJC

# World says :
6 October, 2007 [ 21:42 ]

Suffer & Weep,bunch of cry babes. You ses deserve what you ses get.
HaHAHAHAHA..HA. Sooky baba s. wlingers.

# MJC says :
6 October, 2007 [ 21:52 ]

Who is crying? Who is suffering?

Instant Karma baby...Instant Karma.

If that is all you got to contribute,  WOW!

MJC

# World says :
6 October, 2007 [ 21:56 ]

Sufra y Llore, el manojo de nenes de grito. Usted ses merecen lo que usted ses consigue.
HaHAHAHAHA.. AH. Sooky baba s. wlingers.

# valicia says :
6 October, 2007 [ 22:18 ]

 you ses brought this on yourselves. scavengers pirates, you ses are only in this for a profit,out to make a name for yourselves. You ses just like to be heard,no one else caused this problem,you ses did. Keep away from my country. Fabricantes de problema.

# MJC says :
6 October, 2007 [ 22:19 ]

Dineh ta ka neigh wa.  Chu pah neigh wa. ta neigh.

MJC

# MJC says :
6 October, 2007 [ 22:27 ]

Actually, your the one with the problem... Solve It!

MJC

# Fozpa says :
6 October, 2007 [ 22:30 ]

Sounds like Randall McDaniels is in his cups again.

# AK says :
6 October, 2007 [ 22:53 ]

Lived in Cusco for 10 years, been to Puno many of times as my wife has family there. Her Uncle is a Sargent in the Police in Puno. There is some corruption, no need to debate that, but it is nowhere near the extent some of you are making it out to be. I support you Mike, im a amateur rock hound and have acquired some interesting minerals and even a few meteorites my self, all from Altiplano and Nazca plains. Never once thought of it as criminal behaviour...

# valicia says :
6 October, 2007 [ 23:02 ]

If there is a problem in my country.it is our problem ,stay away,this is our problem to fix,not yours,you make it the way it is,when you stick your nose in it.Go somewhere else and cause your problems,my people maybe poor and they have been for a long time,and you thinking you can come in there and change that over night,because of a few meesly (America $) you must be sick,we and they do not need you to rub their faces in it,because you didn't get what you wanted. Keep away. I have partioned the government to stop all further  associations by tourist wanting to visit this site in further. My quest to you ses is to keep away,go somewhere else. This is the property of the Peruvian Government and Nation.Go make trouble somewhere else.

# Juan valdez says :
6 October, 2007 [ 23:34 ]

Man, what a dump! This country is built on and ran by monkeys! 
I surprised that they not put Fujimori in hole with dirty water to drink and pee on him.

# Peru Homo says :
6 October, 2007 [ 23:54 ]

Vayanse gringos. This meteor is of the people of Peru.We will make some money by to sell on the ebay. We want take more money from you gringos stupid to by poison rock. american theifs, police is good, no corrupt in Peru.

# peeinthewater says :
7 October, 2007 [ 00:08 ]

I guess your answer valicia is for your people to piss on the gift or national treasure that fell from the sky.... You need to get over the conquistador complex thing, and unless you are 100% indios it is not your country anyway... go back to Spain with the invaders.

Peeinthewater

# Crusher says :
7 October, 2007 [ 01:15 ]

Peewee mr know it all  or what ever you call u r self, You were.nt even born. so what the hell do you know. She is more indept to Land of this Nation then you,(know all) But i will be happy to teach you some respect,if everyone agrees.

# Fozpa says :
7 October, 2007 [ 03:12 ]

It's interesting to note that the people really in the know in your country, came in unnoticed, acquired meteorites and are even now selling them on ebay without controversy. Will they be questioned? I agree that the situation got out of control. This is often what happens when a meteorite falls no matter what part of the world the fall occurs in. It's not a matter of greed or entitlement. Hunters like Farmer and even Randall do a service to us all. Lost knowledge does nothing for anyone. Many kinds of knowledge have been revealed by this event.

It's unfortunate that bad light was cast on all the police but it's clear these few took advantage of their authority. Police worldwide have been known to do that and often in a much more severe way.

I sincerely believe that the recovery of meteorites was more important than the motives of all involved. This event is more important than the petty nonsense that has taken precedence over the science.

I agree that you should take care of your own problems. Do it now so this doesn't occur again.

# Cris says :
7 October, 2007 [ 09:15 ]

I would not be surprised if Michael Farmer's story is true. As was mentioned earlier a policeman's salary (outside of Lima) is less than S/.700 a month (less than $US 250). They supplement their salary with 'coimas' or bribes. It's simply the fault of the government (and the police to a lesser degree), this has been going on since time began.

# americorps says :
7 October, 2007 [ 10:44 ]

Cris,

I agree there is some bad corruption with some police, but I have also had some very good and positive experience with police...much like in my own country.  The pay for them is a Peruvian shame if you ask me.

I do not doubt much of Mr. Farmer's story is true, but I also doubt it is totally true.  I think both sides have behaved badly and now that the fiasco has gone public they are both pointing fingers at the other when in reality, like most stories, the truth lies in the middle.

You have some under-paid greedy corrupt cops (not all, some) and an opportunistic confrontational collector who played the situation. 

I think both sides are guilty and I would hope both sides face justice.

# KC says :
7 October, 2007 [ 17:13 ]

To American: Exactly,As what was ask by others,is their are (two sides) of the story,that needs to heard,also what was actually said in Mediation has to be  justified for the sake of both parties.

Take it to court,let the 2 Nations Justice System; clean up this mess.you ses created,(make them return what they have taken from each-other) and then this will go away.

# peru is corrupt period. says :
10 October, 2007 [ 11:44 ]

My wife is peruvian, and i have spent alot of time in peru.

The people in peru have been mistreated and lied to for so long, they must do anything they can just to squeek out a meager living.  It all stems from the government being corrupt.  This in turn leads the people to be corrupt.

You guys had your revolution agaisnt the spanish, but in the end you became greater slaves than you were before.

Peru needs a new revolution, with Real laws, and a better constitution.
More transparency is needed in the government.  And above all, the people need to actually care, as I see it, no one even cares anymore that the government is corrupt.  Millions upon millions of dollars go missing, and nothing is ever done about it...

Peruvians, when are you going to wake up and do something for your beautiful country instead of just for yourself.  

# Mundo_Infinito says :
15 October, 2007 [ 01:45 ]

Oh, for pity's sake, you 2, Farmer and Gregory, are pathetic - like 2 little boys squabbling over toys in a sandbox... And you've been at it for years as anyone can see who looks at the archives at meteoritecentral. You are the laughingstock of the serious scientific community, at least those that take enough of a break from REAL science to notice the rediculous shenanigans of you 2 bumbling Idiots. Please grow up you ludicrous asshats!!!!!
MI.

# Mundo_Infinito says :
15 October, 2007 [ 01:47 ]

Oh, for pity's sake, you 2, Farmer and Gregory, are pathetic - like 2 little boys squabbling over toys in a sandbox... And you've been at it for years as anyone can see who looks at the archives at meteoritecentral. You are the laughingstock of the serious scientific community, at least those that take enough of a break from REAL science to notice the rediculous shenanigans of you 2 bumbling Idiots. Please grow up you ludicrous asshats!!!!!
MI.

# Randall Gregory says :
18 October, 2007 [ 16:47 ]

Mr. Mundo,

This is very very serious. Mike Farmer has tried to ruin my reputation, publicaly slandered me, called my innocent loving wife a whore, has contacted my children through email saying untrue things about me, slandered the reputation of a police chief in Desaguadero, repeatedly lied, told the police in Desaguadero he was a scientist from the University of Colorado. Upset the population of Desaguadero. etc...

He managed to convince the Mayor of Desaguadero to attempt extraction of the meteorite based upon monetary, not scientific value. Fortunatly the meteorite is buried at least 10 meters below the bottom of the crater in mud. The crater would have been destroyed in the process due to Mr. Farmer"s lack of intelligence.


This will not go away...

If Mr. Farmer had not called my wife a cheap whore, it might have gone away.

Randall

# Americorps says :
18 October, 2007 [ 19:15 ]

Randall Gregory's wife is not a cheap whore.  I had to pay her $75 last night!

# americorps says :
18 October, 2007 [ 20:04 ]

just for the record, the above post was not made by me, but by a childish coward who has no life, no worth and when he dies, no one will mourn becuase no one will care, except maybe to rejoice...especially his family who must be so embarassed they are connected to the most worthless person on earth.

# nightrider says :
18 October, 2007 [ 20:09 ]

I like this meteoriteman. anyone with the sack to run around the world and find meteorites is cool to me. I lived in Peru for some years. It is so corrupt, all police and polititions there work to steal any money they can.

# David says :
19 October, 2007 [ 00:07 ]

Americorps, Just admit to it, you said it. Good deversion though.

Just kidding of course it was good for a laugh if you ask me. But then again my name is not Randall.

Sorry for laughing Randall!

# Randall Gregory says :
19 October, 2007 [ 08:24 ]

No problemo, I can apprecitate a good joke>

# Randall Gregory says :
12 December, 2007 [ 04:54 ]

I wanted to provide an update in case anyone might be interested.

When Mr. Farmer returned to the United States, he created a few web pages about his exploits in Peru. He set the price at $100 per gram and in an effort to promote the sales of the meteorites he bought in Peru, he stole the scientific works of a prominent scientist showing the trajectory path of the meteorite.

He stripped the copyright information off of the chart and posted it to his own website to make people think that he created it. He then had the audacity to put at the bottom of the web page that "All information is the Property of Michael Farmer and may not be used".

Later he sold some Carancas meteorites to a fellow dealer, telling this dealer that the meteorites had hit the house that was close to the meteorite crater. I was at the crater long before Mr. Farmer arrived and I know for a fact that the area had been picked clean by the locals. The poor local people knew the meteorites were worth money and spent all day, every day searching for little pieces of the meteorite. Mr. Farmer claims that he waltzed in, and found all these little meteorites along side of the house that had tumbled off the roof. That is the lie that he told this other dealer and this poor dealer is now selling these meteorites and claiming they are "house hitters".

Anyone with common sense would realize that this is just another one of Michael Farmer lies. Imagine for a moment, that you have a bag filled with gold nuggets and you go to the poorest section of a city. Maybe Detroit, Chicago or Los Angeles. You gather the people in the neighborhood and tell them you are going to scatter these nuggets in a field. You tell the residents that the nuggets are worth $700 an ounce.

You come back 2 1/2 weeks later or in the case of Mr. Farmer, 3 weeks. How many nuggets do you think you'll find?

Mr. Farmer claims he found a bunch just lying on the ground. I met many people that had been sifting the ground with a magnet just to get little tiny specks. They were accomplished meteorite spotters and knew exactly what to look for.

# Randall Gregory says :
12 December, 2007 [ 05:13 ]

BTW, MJC is Michael J. Cottingham, age 46, residing in Silver Springs, NM and owner of the Ebay store Nature's Vault. Michael Cottingham is one of the largest meteorite dealers on the Internet and close friend of Michael Farmer.

How's that for an investigative reporter? MJC

# Randall Gregory says :
18 December, 2007 [ 23:23 ]

Please Michael, will you stop the crybaby stuff. Grow up.  And I do not take kindly to DEATH THREATS from you or anybody else. And you call me a nutjob, Mr. Psychologist.  You are the one that needs therapy. With your stupid public statements you tarnished the meteorite and scientific communities in the United States.

> Stray dogs also get shot and dumped in the sewer.
> I am going to stir some shit soon, I am bored with
> you, and no longer amused at a fuckjob.
> Come on to my house, you will see what I can do.

I believe people are sick and tired reading about private personal skirmishes. I promised my wife to keep these exchanges private, but you choose again to make it public. So be it. Let the list have some peace. This is my last post about you, MF. (unless you force me to defend myself again)

You do the meteorite community no justice when you post things like that. New people to the list might not want to stay. Most people know your money motivations and the ploys you use. Like how you tried to discredit an honest bolivian dealer, how you ridicule people, how you make statements without providing any shred of evidence, how you steal scientific works to impress people, and on and on and on. And on the personal side. You send e-mails to my children, get Michael J. Cottingham to tag-team me at the Living in Peru website. You tell the embassy in Lima, Peru lies about me. If this jeopardizes my wife getting her Visa, you will pay dearly for that.  You tell me that you're going to report me to the U.S. customs as a cocaine smuggler. What's next Mike?  I'm including our last exchange at the end of this text body so people can judge for themselves.

And please stop your lies. If people want a compendium of your lies, theft of intellectual property, threats, and cheating with positive proof, they can e-mail me privately.  I have a ton and it paints a very vivid picture.

If you want to deceive honest people and tell everyone some of the Carancas as house hitters go ahead with your little deception, but I know the area was picked clean by the locals. Even the dust around the crater was sifted with magnets before I arrived. I spent two solid days searching the property long before you arrived. Scores of poverty stricken locals were searching from dawn to dusk for two weeks solid.

Imagine going to the poorest section of LA with a bag of gold nuggets, gather the neighborhood and tell them these nuggets are worth $700 an ounce and you going to scatter these nuggets in a field. Then come back 2 1/2 weeks later and see how any nuggets can be recovered. If the people want to believe you just waltzed in a found all these house hitters then so be it. It speaks volumes about the gullibility of some people and the fact that they believe every lie you tell them.

And not to mention the Cali meteorite. How dealers are selling for $1,500 to $3,000 per gram and then you turn around and sell Cali #8 for $300 per gram. I'm sure the people that bought Cali will love that one.

I bet they also believed that those charts you stole from Dr. Jackson and posted to your web-site with the notice at the bottom "That everything was the property of Michael Farmer and can not be used" were yours. Remember that little theft of intellectual property? And the theft of other the other intellectual property that Dr. Jackson told you about. Remember those? 

I'm certain that the scientists you deal with would not want their property stolen by you.

And you want to post private exchanges to the public to gain sympathy? Sympathize this!

From "Mike in Japan" to Randall today:

>Have a nice day, i will be raking in more dough here
>in japan this weekend than you make than you make in a year.
>isnt that just funny?

And what were my so-called threats that you lie about. Exposing you for what you are? Telling people the truth about Carancas. How come Mortiz and Young haven't backed up your story. I know they probably don't speak Spanish but I have the versions that the people in Desaguardero told me. I've been to the crater 3 times and I'll be going back soon.

Were my threats  similar to yours when you wrote to Matteo?

Date: Tue, 13 Jul 2004 22:31:16 -0700 (PDT) from the MetCen Archives

> Hey you retarded dickhead, I was in Europe for the
> weekend, why do you never leave Italy? Are you afraid
> that you will get killed? Do you have no money?
> I will come to venice soon, I will sit outside your
> slum and wait for you to show your fu..cking face, then
> I will pound it in. After the things you have said to
> me, you will pay with alot of pain.
> fu..ck off and die.

Matteo replys: what Farmer write to me in private, seen he not have problems to put my private emails in pubblic

I refuse to post any more personal exchanges to the list and I'm done with this idiot Mike Farmer. Our issues will be handled in court.

Randall

# David says :
19 December, 2007 [ 11:17 ]

It is time for the lot of you to go away!

David

# Randall Gregory says :
19 December, 2007 [ 12:26 ]

Gone...