Lima, Peru | Saturday 07 November 2009 18:22 | | |

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(LIP-ir) -- After severe criticism from Peru's central government and being told to seriously reconsider his actions, the regional president of Cusco, Hugo Gonzales, announced yesterday that the strike which had been planned for Friday would be postponed.# Carlos A. Quiroz says :
15 February, 2008 [ 16:33 ]
Cusco people has the right to protest against this abusive law, and they must defend their Indigenous heritage. Never mind how much money the multinational tourism corporations would lose, tourists will always come to Cusco when justice garantees peace.
There are some things in life you put on sale nor a price tag on. The Garcia government are the ones who should "seriously reconsider his actions."
# legal says :
15 February, 2008 [ 16:41 ]
These people are entitle to have a say in all community discissions 0f changes,restructures and developments that will on a long term basis effect their lives and communities and it is their independant- individual right to freedom of speech to question and acknowledge the major important developments that may hinder their lives and their families.
I know i am going to get feed-back: There is a goodside of what could come out of this for Cusco,but also there is destructive side of what is said and done,is whether this community will benefit resonsibly from the changes set long term or be fundermentively taken advantage of.
I feel personally that the people of these communities should have a major interest to play in how and all interests of the changes to their life styles and the full envolvement in all discission makings,not be typically controlled by foreign interest, again the discission and proceeds of structural growth to and for this community should be for the people of the community and for future Protection of the Enviroment of the Historic landmarks that belong now and always to the people s, cultureof that Nation.
But hey, i am only giving my prospective.
Don't lose control of not focusing on the importants of what the bigger-Picture,is all about. Its better to have what you have, then to have nothing or have it taken away.
I will stand by the People of Cusco,in respect to the presivation of your Indiginess Historic Culture,Values,Beliefs and prequirements to preserve the customary History for and for the building of the Future generation here and for the future to be.
Gracias
# Anonymous Joe says :
15 February, 2008 [ 21:40 ]
Carlos is right, I only wish the people of Cusco could be persuaded to protest in a civil manner, instead of like animals.
# Artur says :
15 February, 2008 [ 21:47 ]
Well there are positive and negative sides to the equation- maybe passing new law will speed up approval process of the constructions in tourist industry- but of course with approval of local authorities, and respect for local culture and heritage. I've heard now it takes up to 4 years to process all the permits of hotel construction- little ridiculous, i bet some people get rich with the process too. So I think the question is how to promote smart growth with investment, while protecting valuable assets.
# legal says :
16 February, 2008 [ 01:52 ]
This person who,calls themself anonymous Joe,who are you,are you peruvian or not and what do you know about these people and their values and who the hell do you think you are,calling these people animals
# juke says :
16 February, 2008 [ 02:42 ]
typical: seing and reading a couple of comment here, are only thinking of profit at the expence of others,with out understanding of the values of what these people are trying to say,as,for these people it is not about making a profit,but about protecting their cultural historic culture,values and sacred ancestral hertage and landmarsk from the greed,profiteering,destruction of what is sacred to these people. So you are right on [ Legal] and as for the prick that called these people animal,look out buster
# Tolduso says :
16 February, 2008 [ 03:03 ]
will cusco benefit from this or is it\this another way for certain ones to get riches at the expence of others,we have seen and see this happening all over the world and what is said,never gives good results,just wait till i come back and say tolduso and listen to the excuses come out left,right and centre
# gringo in cusco says :
16 February, 2008 [ 08:22 ]
the new law will provide one thing for sure, lots of Jobs for the people and their children and grandchildren, anyone that would protest creating jobs for their familys and to having a better future are not seeing the light. why??? cause the regional president Hugo gonzales how is trying to save himself from getting kicked out of his position tells them other things, tells them chile is going to buy machu picchu and other untrue things to get them all worked up.
anonims joe,, I had to go to the cusco airport last week during the protest, after walking across roadblocks tons of broken glass we rode on a cargo tricycle to arrrive at the airport. where all the arriving touists were waiting for hours to get on one police bus that was making trips the downtown hotels in a armed caravan... like something from CNN Irak photos.
and you are close, i would not go so far a to call them animals, i would say they were acting like a bunch of spoiled bratt 6 year olds yelling n screeming breaking glass in the roads burning tires, it was scarry... to see a town that lives off toursim making such a protest. there are pacific ways to make their point, that would not effect their livelyhood of tourism...
# Splaktar says :
16 February, 2008 [ 09:24 ]
No one would have a problem with the strikes if they were done in a civil manner. But Cusco has a long history of violent strikes that not only damage property but close down businesses and damage part of the economy not associated with the strike.
If they just formed marches and such, then they would be heard without damaging the city's tourist image by closing down roads and train tracks. Just because there is a strike does not give people a right to block off or close down businesses or destroy property in the street or in gov't buildings.
If the people and unions of Cusco didn't have such a bad reputation all over the world, then the gov't wouldn't even need to ask for them to postpone the strikes. Hopefully APEC moves all of its meetings out of Cusco anyway. There are plenty of other beautiful Peruvian cities that aren't run by violent criminals like Cusco.
# Anonymous Joe says :
16 February, 2008 [ 09:30 ]
@legal : People who attack and harm others, or their private property are animals, and I have every right to call them so. It is very easy to protest without violence and in the case of SUTEP, child murder, unless you only have your base animal instincts, in which case you are an animal, Peruvian or not.
About the law...
I think Cusco has the right to protest a law which could lead to hasty investment. Fast + Unplanned is always bad. Luckily law makers in Lima gave Cusco full control over it's implementation, thus allowing the same law to pass and work (if it does work) in other regions while it Cusco can happily block its effects. Cusco is often talked down to by Lima, and thus this hasn't been adequately explained to them, so they have resorted to burning things and fighting police.
# jb says :
16 February, 2008 [ 11:56 ]
If I were king, I would begin investing heavily in infrastructure in the Chachapoyas region beginning with airport, daily flights, roads and investment incentives for tourist facilities -- hotels, etc. This area is equally as interesting and beautiful as the Cuzco region.
Then I would have PROMPERU promote the hell out of this area as an alternative to Cuzco and Machu Pichu....and let the Cuzco crowd burn tires, protest, throw rocks and starve. This is their right. Besides, Machu Pichu is nuts to butts now anyway...overcrowded.
# Anonymous Joe says :
16 February, 2008 [ 12:20 ]
@jb : too right.
# Carlos A. Quiroz says :
16 February, 2008 [ 17:57 ]
When people of Cusco have the chance to control and rule over their patrimony without the centralist government of Lima imposing corrupted laws, only then Cusquenos will have the chance to express themselves through decent and dignifying channels of opinion. As now, the only way for Cusquenos to be heard is taking it to the streets. They want the world to understand that they don't care about big hotels and fancy resorts where the locals will be the servants. They want to live with dignity and cherish their heritage.
A fair legislation should not only bring more tourism, but also create more decent jobs and improvement of the living conditions for locals. As for now, Cusco is controlled by mafias and big money, who take the profits away. Cusco welcomes good intentioned visitors, but along come also drugs, prostitution and scammers. It is time to protect the most sacred city of the Quechua people.
# Anonymous Joe says :
16 February, 2008 [ 18:33 ]
People who are hard done by have no right to violence against innocents. Carlos, you seem to say that violent street protests are fine.
Removing corrupt centralist control from Lima will only allow corrupt control to replace it from Cusco. Such regionalism is detrimental to Peru.
I think it is unfortunate that the people of Cusco have to be subservient to outsiders with money. But, that is the way it works. Punishing those with wealth, particularly those with wealth that isn't ill-gotten, by not letting them invest is unfair. Like poor people the world over, the only honest way to get out of it, is to accept that subservience, make sacrifices and use the gains of that subservience to fuel the next generation. It is what happens the world over, like for example, immigrants to the US. They start at the bottom, and work they way up. You can't blame those who are already in a higher position.
This newer legislation, is as fair as it gets. Investment, more tourism and Cusco gets to choose exactly what happens. It would be nice in a magical wonderful world if all of this would lead to high paid jobs and magically improved living conditions, but you can't obligate investors to abandon profits to focus on social issues.
# legal says :
16 February, 2008 [ 18:42 ]
Its a positve thing to look at foreign investment,where it will establish good means,which is all very well to say,but it another, to see implimented developement that will benefit to creating and supporting Cusco,in aspects of employment and growth that is importantly needed, but some of you ses don't really understand what this strike is all about and why these people are in a uproar about the purposed changes that they feel will effect them and their culture (longterm)do you ses really know what this is all about, i bloody doubt it,there is more to this then just Tourism,and hey you pricks don't care two shits.
During the next Apex,why don't Peru Goverment take the Apex Confence all around the areas effected by last year tragic Earthquake to show them some of the real concerns,we are trying to acknowledge and deal with,intend of trying to glorify their own personal prospectives of who they are.with no consideration for the urgencies, needing attention;also the selling off Machu Pichu into foreign investment Tourism.
Okay there are better way s at doing things,but do believe in what is precieved by the media,which make your ascertion of what went on and what it is all about, your prequirement to judge,only through your eye what its about.
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# Carlos A. Quiroz says :
16 February, 2008 [ 18:49 ]
Anonimous Joe I never said that violence is good.
The law is totally unfair because instead of promoting local investors on creating small scale hotels with the direct ownership of Cusquenos, it promotes unfair competition of big hotel chains. But mostly it is dangerous for the protection of historic sites. That is the focus of the protest.
People of Cusco has the final word on this, if they don't want it, no one can force them to accept it. It is their heritage and if Mercedes Araoz wants to make a good profit business at the expenses of the poor, she can always go and build a Machu Picchu hotel in the San Lorenzo island.
# Carlos A. Quiroz says :
16 February, 2008 [ 18:52 ]
Great point Legal,
Why the Garcia administration is not promoting new resorts and housing in Chincha, Canete, Pisco, El Carmen, Ica and the Andean pueblos that were affected by the 2007 earthquake and where people still live in tents and slums.
Simply because they don't care about Peruvians, they care about their pockets.
# Anonymous Joe says :
16 February, 2008 [ 18:59 ]
You are right legal. I will give up my arrogant ways.
Lima is selling Machu Picchu to the Chilenos and Cusqueños into slavery!
Anyway, back in the real world...
1. Cusqueños should protest laws they don't like.
2. Cusqueños should not damage peoples livelyhoods and property in the process.
3. Cusqueños should understand that the law was changed in advance of the protest in their favor.
4. Cusqueños should lead dignified lives.
5. Cusqueños should take advantage of rich folk showing up offering them jobs.
6. Cusqueños should learn from business ventures from outside, and use the money they make from them to out-do them.
7. Cusqueños should not make rash investment decisions that focus on the short term - such as those proposed in this law.
8. Cusqueños should not milk tourists, should allow foriegn investment, and loose their hatred for outsiders (although its understandable how that came about)
# David says :
16 February, 2008 [ 18:59 ]
I see things from both sides. These people that are protesting more then likely feel that is there only way to be heard. Unfortunate but true.
I would imagine that the first time they protested something it was conservative and they didn't get a proper response from those that were supposed to be listening. So they reached out and got more vocal and then violent. That is usually the way it works.
These people feel they have no voice, so they scream! They act out!
Is it wrong to harm innocent people and there property? Of course, without question. But it does force people and governments to take notice.With many Americans subscribing to this news forum I would only ask where would the United States be if we had not "acted out" 238 years ago?
Lets face it the revolution started out with peaceful protests and then escalated from there.
So While I do agree that innocent Men women and children should be left entirely out of the fray, sometimes it is impossible.
I'll leave you with a quote from Thomas Jefferson:
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it’s natural manure."
# Anonymous Joe says :
16 February, 2008 [ 19:11 ]
Carlos, you are right about Garcia, I'm quite disappointed in him. His inaction on inequality, and even his new policies that make it worse, not only make the lives of the majority of Peruvians worse, but he is fueling the reactionist extremist policies that might potentially follow with the next president.
David, you have somewhat altered my opinion. Thank you. In my previous posts, please now read "violence" and "violent protests" and "indiscriminate violence" and "indisciminate violent protests".
# juke says :
16 February, 2008 [ 19:19 ]
you are right [carlos A] as for Anonimous Joe is only thinking of his own aspect s of prospect viewing of this situation,( which is undertaking the prespectives of profit making) ? who is really going to benefit here,at the expence of others,irrespect of the real issues.
So lets say, that for instant that the people of this region excepts the changes,that are being implimented,by the policy maker of this nation and it people and foreign investment,doe see the infracstructure of huge proportionate changes run and controled by Foreign interest,again where do the people in these regions,play their part and how much a part do they play. This is what i,d like to see,as we have seen all over the world.
As like many i Personally also, like many other s on here want to see peruvian nation prosper thru good means in all aspects of Health,Welfare,Employment,Education, Structural Growth and Independants. Just don't going jumping on a rim,that flys by the window,with out being sure you know what it is and what it is going to do for you.
# legal says :
16 February, 2008 [ 19:54 ]
Didn't reaaly mean that, to specificly offend you Anonimous Joe; it just got me up tight,when money is put or used as the main answer to all solutions facing the troubling demises of the world,that we have to become accumtom too.
being the issue s carried here being huge important concerns, around the events and policies of Political Reform that will do practically more damage and harm, then good in relations to this issues and good that there are many valid comments of the major issues need considering .
# business as usual says :
17 February, 2008 [ 09:33 ]
all very good points have been made.
Lets take a look at exactly what this modafication will mean.
" Changes to the law state that the regional government of Cusco has the power to decide where establishments are to be built and if concessions will be granted. "
Very Simple, if any building is to be done now the Regional Presidente is the Man who makes the decision. This means who pays him $$$$ gets their concessions granted.
So business as usual? This whole protest thing was not about anything more than graft money for the Regional Presidente Hugo Gonzales.
# Anonymous Joe says :
17 February, 2008 [ 09:53 ]
Business as usual is quite right. All this means is bribes staying in Cusco, rather that potential bribes going to Lima. Dignified lives indeed.
# INC ?? says :
17 February, 2008 [ 10:08 ]
Very interesting how throughout this whole "soap opra" about consessions near ruin sights the INC has not said one word.
They are normaly very vocal in the press on anything that has to do with ruin sites and culture.
# Anonymous Joe says :
17 February, 2008 [ 10:26 ]
The INC just may not care. Most sites are built on by locals, destroying things in some way or another and the INC does nothing, so long as the healthy salaries continue to be paid.
# Tom says :
17 February, 2008 [ 10:52 ]
Is the strike still going on today (Sunday) or are things back to normal?
# INC ? says :
18 February, 2008 [ 08:55 ]
I read in "el comercio" this morning that yesterday the X director of the INC is speaking out that the new law could be dangerous, also quoted is a well know archaeologist saying that it would not be good.
Why would they use the X director to speak out?
Why does the Current director not make any public comments?
How much did that cost to keep the INC from speaking out on this Law that will hand over their iron clad hold over the ruin sites of peru to the regional goverments?
# legal says :
23 February, 2008 [ 20:42 ]
I like Living in peru to explain to me,what is wrong with my comment made on 16 february at(18.42) that make you think it needed EDITING
I will at the Apex conference and during that i guarrantee i will ask those same concerns i made and of the people,along with the voiced International concerns,by all in attendance on a Global prospective of this nations Humanitarian interest, just remember,a lot of the world gave huge financial support to the concerning issue around the Tragedy (last August) to the Nation of Peru and its people effected, now has that financial support been delivered to the proceeds (intended) or has it,been miss used.
# David says :
23 February, 2008 [ 20:52 ]
Legal,
I am the moderator of the forum section on LIP. I was not the one that deleted your comment. If you PM what your exact comments were maybe I can help you understand what LIP took exception to.
If I cannot explain it I will make every effort to find out the answer for you.
David
# Editor says :
23 February, 2008 [ 21:30 ]
Legal,
It is not necessary to insult others when stating your opinion. If you do not agree with someone you can express that without insulting them.
Only your insults were removed from your comment. Your opinion on foreign investment was not edited in any way.
We are attempting to make the comments section more enjoyable for all and hope everyone cooperates with us. We thank all of you for voicing your opinions and hope you will keep doing so.
# legal says :
24 February, 2008 [ 00:36 ]
To the Editor: [What insults], i can take you around your site (right now) and show you worse\more offence comments and personal attacks on members, then my comments + why haven't you sited them or should i taken them to other Media sourse to be viewed.Add your comment
As from now i won't be making any further comments and letting the people of Peru decide,which you have no say (end of story)
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